CZ Dubai Q&A Full Text: When I stepped down as CEO of Binance, I actually cried
Source: Market Information
(Source: Wu Says)
During the Binance Blockchain Week held in Dubai on December 3-4, 2025, Binance founder CZ participated in a group interview. The Q&A covered topics such as crypto payments, digital asset treasury, U.S. policy, Giggle Academy, life aspirations, and more. CZ believes that payments are still a core scenario that has not been fully addressed. Successful Web3 founders in the future need to be product and user-centric with a long-term mindset. The DAT model is feasible, but the risk depends on the management team. The reopening of U.S. regulation will bring tremendous opportunities to the industry. The mainstream adoption of crypto technology relies on regulatory clarity, infrastructure, and enterprise-level integration. Crypto has significantly improved financial accessibility in developing countries, and education, public welfare, and ecological promotion are his future personal focuses.
The content reflects the personal views of the guest and does not represent Wu's views. The audio transcription is done by GPT and may contain errors. Please listen to the complete podcast on platforms like Xiaoyuzhou and YT.
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Why has the crypto industry still not truly solved the 'payment' problem?
CZ: I believe that payment is still the most obvious core scenario that has not been truly solved to date. The Bitcoin white paper defines it as an 'electronic cash payment system.' Over the years, countless teams have attempted to create crypto payments, but we still haven't fully achieved this.
There are various projects like Binance Pay and BitPay out there, but there still exists the 'chicken or egg' problem. First is the volatility of cryptocurrency prices — Bitcoin and most crypto assets are too volatile. Although there are stablecoins now, our ideal situation is that users can pay directly with cryptocurrencies. However, in reality, due to various factors, crypto payments have not yet been popularized offline.
One viable direction is to integrate crypto payments into traditional payment systems, such as the Binance Card. The reason these cards are popular is simple: when users swipe their cards for payment, merchants only see the fiat currency credited, while users are using cryptocurrency in the background, making the entire crypto-to-fiat exchange experience very smooth. Unfortunately, during the tightening of regulations under the Biden administration, most of our Binance Card projects were forced to halt. However, the situation is improving now, and I hope such solutions can become popular again in the coming years.
In summary, although there are many different technological paths, 'payment' remains one of the biggest challenges that the crypto industry has yet to overcome.
What was Binance's original vision? How has it evolved over time?
CZ: Predicting the future is really difficult. When we founded Binance, my goal was to become one of the top ten exchanges globally within three years, but we became number one in just five months.
Initially, we considered setting up offline offices, but quickly realized it wasn't a good idea, so we tried to make Binance a 'decentralized company' — without a headquarters or fixed office location. But later we found that this would cause significant confusion for regulators, as they need to know where a company is registered. So we had to adjust our thinking again.
Throughout this process, various external forces push us forward and force us to change direction. Looking ahead, centralized exchanges must be fully regulated entities with clear headquarters and office locations; at the same time, on-chain solutions are becoming increasingly popular. I believe that in the future, centralized and decentralized forms will coexist in the long term.
If I could go back in time, perhaps I would see everything more clearly the second time I did this.
What kind of founders will stand out in the next cycle?
CZ: This is a big question, but I think the most critical point is 'product-oriented' — those founders who genuinely focus on creating products that users will actually use and truly understand their users will be the ones who can stay in this industry. Mission-driven and ethically upright founders will also continue to exist.
The crypto industry is inherently highly volatile. We may be in a bull market now, but there will certainly be bear markets afterward, and then another bull market, repeating this cycle. Regulatory environments in different countries will also continue to change, sometimes positively and sometimes repressively, in a cyclical manner. Founders who can navigate through these cycles and persist will ultimately win.
In summary, those who can truly succeed are founders who create real products, focus on users, and are prepared to cultivate this industry for the long term.
If you could make a wish, what would you want the most?
CZ: I would be content with just one wish (laughs). But honestly, I don’t have many wishes. Life is interesting precisely because it is full of uncertainties. When you don’t know what will happen next, you strive, you fight, and you learn to face uncertainty.
Just like playing a game, if you are told at the start that you will definitely win, it actually makes it less fun. What truly gives meaning to a game are the parts that require you to struggle, respond carefully, collaborate, and get things done. The challenges of life are part of the fun.
The only thing I genuinely hope for is that everyone can be healthy. Health is the most important, and even if you maintain good habits, it is not entirely under your control. Health is truly critical.
Besides that, I feel that the world is already interesting enough. I also believe that precisely because life is not infinite, we cherish it more. If you could live forever, time would become unimportant, and life would not be so worth cherishing.
When you might lose something, you truly understand its value. So I don't have too many special wishes; I already feel very lucky. The only thing I ask is: don't let me fall into long-term bad luck. Besides that, I am quite satisfied with my current life.
Is the Digital Asset Treasury (DAT) model sustainable?
CZ: Firstly, I believe the Digital Asset Treasury (DAT) model is logically sound. It allows traditional companies — especially those that cannot directly purchase large amounts of crypto assets — to access and allocate crypto assets. Many companies and CFOs are allowed to use corporate treasury to buy stocks but do not have mechanisms to buy tokens, so the DAT model perfectly fills this demand.
However, there are many types of specific practices within DAT. Because MicroStrategy has been so successful, everyone wants to replicate its model. But just because an internet company is successful does not mean all companies have the same management capabilities. The fee structures of different DAT management teams also vary; I personally prefer lower fees; the simpler the DAT structure, the better.
MicroStrategy's model is very straightforward: just buy Bitcoin. And if BNB's treasury is used well with tools like Launchpad, Launchpool, and airdrops, it can yield quite considerable returns (annualized returns of 10-50% are possible), which is very high for traditional stock markets.
However, some DATs aim to make things 'more complex' or 'more valuable,' for example, by using 10% of the company's treasury to invest in different crypto assets. That has actually turned into a completely different business model that requires professional asset management capabilities, and different combinations will bring completely different risk structures; the level of risk entirely depends on the management team's capabilities.
The entire industry has a lot of variability. DAT is definitely not without risk; it has significant risks and relies heavily on the management team, governance structure, and investment philosophy. But fundamentally speaking, it is entirely reasonable for a publicly listed company to buy top crypto assets, hold them for the long term, and benefit from their appreciation. Just executing this simply can create a lot of value.
In my view, holding Bitcoin for the long term is one of the best strategies. Its returns over the past 10-15 years have outperformed 99% of startups and exceeded almost all other investment strategies. So even if a publicly listed company just executes the simple 'buy and hold,' it can generate significant value in the long run. The model itself is viable — the key is execution and management.
Of course, when a narrative becomes very popular, it can easily overheat. Everyone rushes to establish DATs, leading to an overcrowded market where some will fail, and others will be eliminated. After the first wave of excitement subsides, only truly stable and well-managed DATs will continue to grow.
Will the U.S. become Binance's key market after the Trump pardon?
CZ: Firstly, I have no personal business dealings with the Trump family. But I am very grateful for this presidential pardon because it allows me and our team to conduct business more freely globally — including in the U.S. Honestly, I sincerely hope to help the U.S. become the global crypto capital.
For us, the U.S. now counts as an 'emerging market.' Over the past few years, under the regulatory pressure of the previous administration, we tried to withdraw from the U.S. as much as possible: not engaging with U.S. users, not investing in the U.S., retreating wherever possible. Binance US is still around, but its business scale is very small. On the day we were sued by the SEC in 2023, it had about a 35% market share, and now it is almost close to zero.
At that time, bank ports couldn't be opened, and state licenses were restricted. But now, as far as I understand, the U.S. market has fully reopened. The U.S. itself is an extremely important market, leading the world in technology, AI, and other fields — but in the blockchain space, the largest companies are currently not in the U.S. I hope to promote more crypto businesses to return to the U.S.
Many American investors, especially institutional investors, currently lack exposure and investment channels to the BNB ecosystem, and we hope to change that. Everything is moving towards openness. I also fully intend to support the development of the U.S. crypto industry — including investing, supporting entrepreneurial teams, and helping more projects join the BNB Chain ecosystem.
How to maintain mental health amidst public pressure and negative media?
CZ: For me, it’s actually not that difficult. I know that Binance — whether as a platform or an ecosystem — has genuinely helped hundreds of millions of people worldwide, especially those in remote areas where financial services are almost nonexistent.
Although online, especially in mainstream media, there are many negative reports and various accusations, I also receive many letters of thanks. When I go to court, I received a total of about 230 letters of support. When reading those letters, I nearly cried — because we have indeed changed many people's lives, and this is just a tiny fraction of those we have helped. So public opinion is always two-sided.
Regarding the 'black' on the internet, I roughly categorize it into two types:
The first category is mainstream media, which often pushes a narrative against crypto: for example, 'cryptocurrencies are dangerous' or 'Bitcoin is used for illegal transactions,' etc. Most of these narratives come from traditional institutions that fear new technology. In the U.S. — although I do not engage in politics — some Democrats, like Elizabeth Warren, have also been attacking the crypto industry. I don't understand why because most Americans actually support crypto. This group is the first category.
The second category is those who lose money in trading. When making money, everything is great; when losing money, they want to blame others. I can understand their frustration, but investing inherently requires taking on risk. No exchange can guarantee you will always make money. Whether in stocks, entrepreneurship, or other investments, there are risks; not investing is also a risk — you may never accumulate wealth. Life is a series of trade-offs.
Understanding these basic logics makes the mindset much more relaxed. I have been through a lot, including being imprisoned. But I know that no users were harmed, there was no fraud, and no misconduct. I took full responsibility for my actions. Therefore, I can sleep soundly, knowing I have indeed helped many people.
Over time, you learn to automatically filter out meaningless noise. But I will seriously consider 'constructive negative feedback' — for example, someone points out where a product can be improved, which partners can be collaborated with, which functions are not done well enough. These can help us improve, and I will take a look. As for those who only complain without any substantial content... let's consider that background noise.
What needs to happen for crypto to truly achieve mainstream adoption?
CZ: I believe this is a gradual process. The so-called 'mainstream adoption' is essentially allowing traditional financial users to naturally use crypto technology. The first step must be clear regulation. Many countries around the world still do not have sufficiently clear regulatory frameworks. I am personally collaborating with over a dozen countries, and our team is assisting governments, including Kenya, Pakistan, Thailand, etc., in reviewing regulations and even holding workshops to explain how exchanges operate, how crypto works, and the mechanisms of the entire industry.
I personally serve as an advisor to several countries. However, there are still very few countries that have clear and forward-looking regulations. The U.S. is now beginning to take the lead, which is a good sign, but it’s still early. Trump has only been in office for a year, (Genius Act) has already passed, and (Clarity Act) is still in progress. The first version of regulation is often imperfect and requires time to iterate.
Once regulations are established, banks also need to start collaborating with crypto businesses. Crypto is not magic; it’s just new technology. For it to achieve widespread adoption, it must integrate with the existing financial system.
There are many practical problems that need to be solved in between:
· How should companies hold cryptocurrency assets?
· How to handle cross-border taxation?
· How should crypto assets be presented in financial reports?
How should auditing firms conduct audits? These need to be standardized; it's not particularly difficult, but it requires time and coordination.
Currently, crypto-native financial products are also severely lacking. The entire industry has a scale of about 3-4 trillion dollars, but in the long term, it should be at the level of 30-40 trillion dollars. We are still very early. For payments to mature, more financial products also need to be built.
Any new technology takes time to go mainstream. Back in 1995, people fantasized about video conferencing and VR meetings, but even today VR meetings have not become popular, and video calls still have the issue of 'Can you hear me? Can you see me?' Technological maturity often spans decades.
The disruptive nature of crypto is stronger, so it may take longer — even generations. But it will ultimately happen.
How can crypto technology bring real value to emerging markets?
CZ: I believe that developing countries actually have more opportunities. First, many places lack mature financial infrastructure. For example, in some African countries, the bank account penetration rate is less than 11%. But the spread of smartphones is very rapid — 50%, 60%, or even 70%. This creates a perfect environment: people can immediately access financial services by simply downloading an app. In many places, even the most basic payment networks do not exist.
I once received a letter from someone saying that in 2017, it took him three days to pay a bill by walking from his village to another town. After using cryptocurrency, it only took three minutes. This way, he could save three days each month. Moreover, he started to have access to new asset classes, even if he only invested a little bit. He initially invested 50 dollars, which later turned into 300, and then to 1,000 dollars. For someone from a very poor country, hundreds of dollars represent a significant improvement. His life underwent substantive changes, and he wrote me a very moving letter.
In many developing countries, the local currency is unstable, and inflation, even hyperinflation, occurs frequently. Bitcoin and stablecoins provide them with a hedging tool. Some countries even lack their own currency and can only use the dollar. When the Federal Reserve engages in quantitative easing, these countries do not receive any new money; they are only passively 'diluted.' Therefore, for these places, cryptocurrencies may actually be a better choice.
Developing countries also have a characteristic: a very young population. Young people naturally like crypto. For example, in Pakistan, where I have been collaborating, the average age is only 25 years. The population is young, open-minded, and they really like crypto. Now the government is also beginning to realize that 'whatever the people want, we should follow.'
So it ultimately depends on the leadership of the country. If the leaders are open-minded and willing to find the best path for the country, I strongly encourage them to embrace crypto technology. And we are very willing to help.
How is Giggle Academy progressing in promoting free education?
CZ: Firstly, it is not a business project — it is a completely free educational platform. I just had a meeting with the team this morning. Giggle Academy currently serves about 88,000 children, with about three to four thousand new students each week, growing very quickly.
The platform now has around 300 courses and two to three thousand storybooks. The main content is currently in English, with some basic Arabic content recently added. The storybooks are available in 30–40 language versions through AI. The team is also continuously expanding content and enhancing interactive experiences.
Currently, AI's interaction capabilities are still not strong enough, especially the voice recognition effect when children speak is not ideal, and the team is working on this. The team currently has about 60 full-time members and several hundred content contributors. The first 8-9 months were supported by my personal funding.
Later we wanted to design an incentive mechanism for contributors and launched a donation page. Someone created a meme coin based on this project, which quickly brought about 11 million dollars in donations to Giggle Academy. We are now planning how to use these funds to further expand the platform.
Overall, Giggle Academy is progressing very well. It is not a business — all educational content is free. If your child is between 2 and 6 years old, you can give it a try. Children keep coming back to use it; it's very 'addictive.' They learn vocabulary, phonics, concepts, and other content through games.
Next, we want to expand to more languages. We started with English, but later realized that English content cannot simply be translated into Chinese or Arabic — each language needs to design the curriculum in the most suitable way for that language. Therefore, we must build the curriculum system from scratch for each language, and we will do so.
In Abu Dhabi, the local leadership is very fond of this platform and has requested us to deploy it to local kindergartens. They are even willing to provide funding support, but we told them that money is not the limitation; the key is the ability to expand deployment.
We also want to quickly add Korean, but that depends on our capacity for course production. In the long run, I hope to develop a set of tools that enables anyone to create course content themselves, meaning that educational content truly achieves user-generated content (UGC). However, creating courses that children like, have excellent animation, and can keep children focused is actually very difficult; we are still continuously optimizing using AI technology.
This is a true passion project for me. I invest several hours each week to work with the team, which is working full-time on it.
What public welfare directions and social projects will you primarily support in the future?
CZ: Firstly, I believe that money is not meant to be hoarded but is a tool for doing things. Money allows us to push forward truly meaningful things. Currently, the public welfare direction I am primarily investing in is education. However, honestly, I personally have not spent much money — supporting the sixty-person team of Giggle Academy has probably only cost one or two million dollars. Later, the community donated 11 million dollars, but that is not my money and will be used entirely for the education platform itself. As long as you are doing something truly valuable, fundraising is actually not difficult.
As for my own wealth, I am still exploring how to invest more effectively. When I was leading Binance, we had a complete charity team that I could rely on. Now I no longer have that team, so I am considering rebuilding it — it may not need to be large; one or two people specifically responsible for researching different public welfare directions will suffice.
I've met many interesting people. For example, I met Bill McGlashan yesterday, who was a senior executive at a well-known VC and also served time for a very unique and unprecedented case (ten years before me). I got to know him while going through that process myself. Now he is working on a social project, researching new soil microbiomes. Due to fertilizers and over-cultivation, many soils around the world have lost their nutrients, and his project's goal is to restore soil health. He does not intend to profit from this — this is a non-profit project, but the business model is sustainable.
This type of project is what I am currently focusing on. I previously said I wouldn't engage in climate-related philanthropy, but the soil project is actually closely related to climate. Restored soil can absorb about 30% of atmospheric lower-level carbon emissions. Although I am not an expert in this field, I often encounter people doing these truly impactful things.
Apart from education, I have not yet locked onto a specific public welfare theme; in other areas, I will rely more on the judgment of experts.
Additionally, I have long privately donated to an organization called Prison Professors, which focuses on prison education and support for inmates. I donated anonymously through another organization, which helps orphans in the U.S., Thailand, and other countries. So currently, my public welfare projects are distributed across several small directions and are still in the exploratory stage.
I personally hope that in the future all donations can be fully on-chain and conducted using crypto, so that the entire process can be completely transparent and traceable to the final beneficiaries. But the reality is that many final beneficiaries do not use crypto wallets. If we require that only crypto methods be used for payments, the reachable population will become very small. So this part needs to be balanced.
At this stage, I am trying to collaborate with different public welfare organizations, observing which ones are efficient and which can truly make an impact, and then deciding which directions to support in the long term.
What will the world look like when 1 billion people use Web3?
CZ: I believe that eventually everyone will naturally use Web3. In that future, we shouldn't discuss terms like 'crypto' or 'Web3.' Discussing crypto is like discussing TCP/IP — that's just a foundational protocol; discussing blockchain is like discussing the underlying structure of the network. Ordinary users shouldn't even feel the existence of these technologies.
People should only say, 'I want to pay someone,' 'I want to send something,' 'I want to buy something.' Just like today we say, 'I'll Google it,' brands become verbs, and the technology itself is completely hidden. Ideally, users do not need to understand TPS, do not need to know about fees, do not need to know about Gas, and there should be no concept of 'address.' You should only need to input the other person's name to make a payment.
We need to completely abstract away all complexities.
But now, technology and the overall industry have not yet developed to that point. We need to create better and easier-to-use products, and it doesn’t necessarily have to be done by Binance; it will be an ecosystem formed by multiple applications and products.
Ultimately, I believe there will be a certain concentration effect in the ecosystem. Today, when you want to search for something, you usually use Google — although AI is challenging it now, network effects usually give rise to a dominant platform. I believe a similar pattern will also emerge in the future of Web3.
This is my vision for the future.
What is your view on Binance's new leadership structure? Where will your focus be in the future?
CZ: I believe this is a very natural evolution. He Yi was originally a co-founder; she has a very strategic vision and is extremely hardworking. She is very closely connected to the community — whether on Twitter or Chinese social media, she is very active, understands users, understands products, and her thinking is very strategic. She is truly one of the most diligent and resilient people I've ever met.
She has always had a significant influence in the company, and her current title is just a formalization of what she has been doing. I believe she will continue to do very well. Current feedback is generally positive. The Western market may not be very familiar with her, but Asian users are well aware of her. Even the Western feedback I have received has been very good; I believe she will excel in this role.
She is also nine years younger than me, which is actually quite natural. I became a CEO around 40, and she is just at that stage now. For her, taking on greater leadership responsibilities is a natural path. Although it is now a formal title, she has effectively been taking on these responsibilities informally for a long time.
Her and Richard's abilities are very complementary. Richard has a stronger background in regulation and is more fluent in English. Her English is indeed still a limitation — although it has improved. When you listen to her speak, you will hear many grammatical errors, but she can accurately convey information. Moreover, her learning ability is very strong; these are very rare qualities.
For me personally — when I stepped down as CEO of Binance, I actually cried. When I wrote that announcement blog post, it was four in the morning in Seattle, and I cried while writing. It took me a while to adjust. But then I suddenly realized: life can be this easy. During nearly a year in the U.S., I couldn't do anything, so I went skiing, kitesurfing, and so on. Later, when I returned to the company and saw everything running smoothly, I actually felt relieved. I realized that I didn’t need to return to daily management.
Life is about moving forward, not backward.
Now I am investing more in ecosystem building — including projects in the BNB Chain ecosystem, helping different entrepreneurs, and collaborating more frequently with Nina. This is actually my first time meeting her offline — just in the first minute — even though we often communicate online.
We help founders through projects like YZi Labs and Giggle Academy. I am also assisting different countries in establishing regulatory frameworks for crypto, which is a way of thinking about the future of the crypto industry from the 'regulatory side,' which is quite interesting.
For me, not being involved in Binance's daily management is actually a good thing; it helps the growth of the BNB Chain and the entire ecosystem. I enjoy my current work. The Binance team is already very strong, and a person should not stay in the same position for too long — moderate handovers and updates benefit the organization and create opportunities for the next generation of leaders.
I believe this adjustment is a better direction for everyone.
What daily habits most promote your success?
CZ: I believe that learning a little new every day is very important for success. What schools teach us mostly revolves around reading, writing, basic logical thinking, and some math — and those are really all we remember. Schools do not teach you entrepreneurship, negotiation, leadership, financial literacy, or how startups operate. These are the most important skills in life, and you have to learn them on your own.
If you are a professional, like a doctor or a lawyer, you will use a lot of the knowledge learned in school. But for most people, especially entrepreneurs, you must continually self-learn and learn from users. You need to maintain an open mindset. Learning a little every day can prevent rigid thinking and allow you to continually see new opportunities.
Another very important habit is: work hard while maintaining health. Entrepreneurship is not only about brainpower; it’s also about physical labor, and you must have a strong body. You need to cultivate good habits: be able to withstand pressure, sleep well, eat healthily, exercise regularly, and take care of your body. You must be able to work long hours while staying healthy — even if it’s 16 hours a day.
So for me, these habits are very important.
